11/8 - Why?

Octavian · Post by **Octavian** » Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:38 pm

Why are so many of GH riffs in 11/8?

What's wrong with good old fashion prog rock 7/8 or 5/8?

Too mainstream for you?

The only other 11/8 off the top of my head is from the middle of Gates of Delirium.

Anyone else willing to volunteer their favourite 11/8 riff?

I'll get my coat...

Post by **FredProgGH** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 2:41 am

The funny thing is, we never count them out; we just play them... let's see, the beginning of Tales is 11, I guess... what else??

Octavian · Post by **Octavian** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:29 am

I really like that!

4/4 music is great to dance to, but there's a different rhythmic pleasure to non metric time signatures.

I was awakened to the joys of such when I first heard Stravinsky's 'The Rite of Spring' as a teen. It was so unlike anything I'd heard before and I loved the unsteady, relentless, lumbering yet arcane music.

I would very strongly recommend it to all the Hammerheads here. Give it a couple of listens as its kinda non-standard. Its only 30 minutes long and has a Supper's Ready kind of different-bit-every-two-minutes feel.

<nerd> Many people know that there was a riot the first time RoS was played . What is less well known is that the riot was actually concerning the choreography of Diaghilev's ballet to which RoS was the accompaniment. What is even less well known is that the riot was staged. (My composition tutor was Stephen Walsh, an author of books on Stravinksy) </nerd>

rox · Post by **rox** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:49 am

I hardly count something 11/8, I'll just say it is a 6/8 and a 5/8, or a 4/4 and a 3/8, something like that.

And 7/8 is getting really quite mainstream!

Post by **Sam Gamgee** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 2:01 pm

(using the Sam notation:) <confession>One of the things that makes me a terrible prog fan: I can never tell what time signatures in. I always try, but I can never figure it out.

And what's the fun of being a prog fan if you can't brag about what time signature your favorite riffs are in?</confession>

Post by **FredProgGH** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 2:25 pm

rox wrote:I hardly count something 11/8, I'll just say it is a 6/8 and a 5/8, or a 4/4 and a 3/8, something like that.

Yeah, that's more what we feel when we play I think. You don't count to 11, you think 4, 4, 3 - 4, 4, 3... or for Tales, 3, 4, 4 - 3, 4 ,4- but to write it down 11 would be easiest so you don't have to insert a meter change on every single measure!!

SuperTed · Post by **SuperTed** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 4:24 pm

I shall contribute to this thread by stating that I won't be contributing in the slightest since I have no idea what a time signature is

Are you allowed to listen to prog and be that ignorant at the same time?

But...as PG said "I know what I like!"

rox · Post by **rox** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:36 pm

FredProgGH wrote:
rox wrote:I hardly count something 11/8, I'll just say it is a 6/8 and a 5/8, or a 4/4 and a 3/8, something like that.

Yeah, that's more what we feel when we play I think. You don't count to 11, you think 4, 4, 3 - 4, 4, 3... or for Tales, 3, 4, 4 - 3, 4 ,4- but to write it down 11 would be easiest so you don't have to insert a meter change on every single measure!!

Haha, then you can write a song in a single 10000/8 compass!

Theremin · Post by **Theremin** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:44 am

Rite of Spring rocks! I really like Firebird too. Our marching badn played it sophomore year and it was so awesome! We got to march in 7/8!

Post by **FredProgGH** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:28 am

rox wrote:
FredProgGH wrote:
rox wrote:I hardly count something 11/8, I'll just say it is a 6/8 and a 5/8, or a 4/4 and a 3/8, something like that.

Yeah, that's more what we feel when we play I think. You don't count to 11, you think 4, 4, 3 - 4, 4, 3... or for Tales, 3, 4, 4 - 3, 4 ,4- but to write it down 11 would be easiest so you don't have to insert a meter change on every single measure!!
Haha, then you can write a song in a single 10000/8 compass!

Yeah, I guess... the count-off would be a bit annoying...

CanarioAB · Post by **CanarioAB** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:34 pm

FredProgGH wrote:Yeah, I guess... the count-off would be a bit annoying...

No kidding ... especially when you lose your place and have to start over.

April
http://theprogpalace.com

DruidsGlass · Post by **DruidsGlass** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:58 pm

yea, 4/4 is fun to dance to, but dancing to odd meters is even MORE fun...hehehe (of course, so is dancing to EW&F)

Post by **Venividi** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:13 pm

I propose that today (the 8th of November) be declared Prog Time Signature Day (along with the 8th of June & July of course)!

BTW - This will only work in America (European date format being different & all)

SuperTed · Post by **SuperTed** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 2:27 pm

I wrote:I shall contribute to this thread by stating that I won't be contributing in the slightest since I have no idea what a time signature is

Ignoring the delightfully self-centred fact that I'm quoting myself

, I have to bite...

Can one of you musos actually tell me how to "read" a time signature? Or point me at the Cloth-Ears Guide to Music so I can read it for myself.

Apologies for being musically dense but I really am interested...no, seriously...

NP The Associates - Party Fears Two (ah, memories!)

Elrabin · Post by **Elrabin** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:55 pm

Can one of you musos actually tell me how to "read" a time signature?

I'm hoping that by 'muso' you mean anyone at all that has a modicum of experience with music. :) It helps to have a little bit of music knowledge, 'cause otherwise this will all sound like nonsense anyways. I'll take a crack at it, though. Please forgive me if I assume too little of you.

In music, all the notes (all the individual little sounds) are broken up into 'measures' for readability. Kinda like words broken up into sentences. Except instead of being breaking it up into groups of meaning (like how sentences are), measures put notes into groups based on 'time.' The time signature tells you how this is done for a specific piece of music.

The first number in a time signature (like 4/4) is the number of beats in a measure. So, in 4/4, each measure is going to think 1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4, etc. Maybe a person won't play a note on every beat, but the timing scheme is there. The second number tells you what kind of note 'gets the beat.' In 4/4, the one-quarter note gets the beat (so each quarter note is counted as one beat). In 6/8, the one-eighth note (1/8) gets the beat, and there are 6 beats in a measure. (The different types of notes - half, quarter, eighth, etc. - determine how long an individual note is played).

If that was completely unclear (and it probably was), maybe one or both of the following websites will be more useful.

http://www.musictheory.net/load.php?id=12
http://cnx.rice.edu/content/m10956/latest/

Hope that helps.